Comments for The Deliberate Ruminator http://tree63fan.wordpress.com Things you want to know Sun, 29 Nov 2009 22:21:21 +0000 http://wordpress.com/ hourly 1 Comment on My Journal by tree63fan http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/my-journal/#comment-1044 tree63fan Sun, 29 Nov 2009 22:21:21 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?page_id=810#comment-1044 Both of the twins died and are home in heaven now. Mark and Jen are in my prayers. Both of the twins died and are home in heaven now. Mark and Jen are in my prayers.

]]> Comment on My Journal by tree63fan http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/my-journal/#comment-1043 tree63fan Sun, 29 Nov 2009 22:20:13 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?page_id=810#comment-1043 Well, it appears I took a vacation from journaling! The last couple of weeks have been very nice. I'm really, finally in the mood for Christmas this year and already have gotten several decorations up that I enjoy and did not get put up last year....The Colts are still undefeated, I know, I know, that's truly not important but the part of me that is stuck in this world likes it. Thanksgiving was a good time of thanking God for all He has provided. I saw all of my immediate family and had fun doing it. I also probably gained back 4 lbs from my latest weightloss but that was somewhat expected! I've been getting a lot our of the book of Luke when I have spent time reading it. Our church sermons have also been in Luke (the travel narrative). My wife and I had a very nice date night as well. What a great couple of weeks. Well, it appears I took a vacation from journaling! The last couple of weeks have been very nice. I’m really, finally in the mood for Christmas this year and already have gotten several decorations up that I enjoy and did not get put up last year….The Colts are still undefeated, I know, I know, that’s truly not important but the part of me that is stuck in this world likes it.
Thanksgiving was a good time of thanking God for all He has provided. I saw all of my immediate family and had fun doing it. I also probably gained back 4 lbs from my latest weightloss but that was somewhat expected!
I’ve been getting a lot our of the book of Luke when I have spent time reading it. Our church sermons have also been in Luke (the travel narrative).
My wife and I had a very nice date night as well.
What a great couple of weeks.

]]> Comment on Why wait till day 8 to Circumcise? by tree63fan http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/2008/07/01/why-wait-till-day-8-to-circumcise/#comment-1041 tree63fan Sat, 21 Nov 2009 17:05:59 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?p=228#comment-1041 Greg, I feel you misread some of what I wrote. I apologize that my wording was not clear...I said it was NOT a problem to clean having foreskin, the same as it's not a problem to clean without foreskin. [<strong>I do know that some males have a hard time keeping themselves clean especially at young ages and these males don’t have foreskins to deal with. Either way, with or without a foreskin, a male CAN keep themselves reasonably clean, reasonable easily. I have no problem either way.</strong>] You feel very strongly that circumcision is akin to amputation and I disagree. Respectfully, we aren't going to change each others minds. Maybe they don't do it in Canada, but in the states many baby girls nowadays get their ears pierced at 1-2 years old or less....At that age is it consensual? Personally, I don't think so...But it's not "amputation" as you define it, so it must be alright. You ask me where do I draw the line?...I draw the line at what is legal. <strong>As I mentioned, circumcision is not against the law (in the USA) and it is a parent's right.</strong> You have shown nothing to combat that. You could look at any surgical procedure known to man and find someone who has been sued over it. Scientific conclusions are constantly changing as new research is done. Last I checked, laws are a product of the people, science doesn't dictate law, people do. As the will of the people change, a law can change. If that occurs I will abide by it. [ie I completely disagree with abortion in any form, but it's legal so all I can do is simply argue my opinion as you are doing. I can vote for public servants who agree with me and hope that one day the laws change.] You appear more studied on this subject regarding biblical circumcision and current circumcision. Knowing today's medical advances I would be surprised if circumcision methods hadn't changed over time, but I am not an expert at all. Obviously, God did not make a mistake. Biblical circumcision had nothing to do with health as far as I know...My last paragraph is based on faith (assuming you were questioning God's Word and my belief in it). If anything...God declared that circumcision was okay. In various translations of the Bible, I cannot find a translation noting a "[nick] on the genitals". "Each male among you must be circumcised. You must cut off the flesh of your foreskin as a sign of the covenant between me and you. From generation to generation, every male child must be circumcised on the eighth day after his birth." (in Gen 17)...That is the typical translation... I appreciate your opinion, but we obviously completely disagree with one another and are dedicated to our stances. Blessings! Jeff Greg,
I feel you misread some of what I wrote. I apologize that my wording was not clear…I said it was NOT a problem to clean having foreskin, the same as it’s not a problem to clean without foreskin.
[I do know that some males have a hard time keeping themselves clean especially at young ages and these males don’t have foreskins to deal with. Either way, with or without a foreskin, a male CAN keep themselves reasonably clean, reasonable easily. I have no problem either way.]

You feel very strongly that circumcision is akin to amputation and I disagree. Respectfully, we aren’t going to change each others minds. Maybe they don’t do it in Canada, but in the states many baby girls nowadays get their ears pierced at 1-2 years old or less….At that age is it consensual? Personally, I don’t think so…But it’s not “amputation” as you define it, so it must be alright. You ask me where do I draw the line?…I draw the line at what is legal. As I mentioned, circumcision is not against the law (in the USA) and it is a parent’s right. You have shown nothing to combat that. You could look at any surgical procedure known to man and find someone who has been sued over it. Scientific conclusions are constantly changing as new research is done. Last I checked, laws are a product of the people, science doesn’t dictate law, people do. As the will of the people change, a law can change. If that occurs I will abide by it. [ie I completely disagree with abortion in any form, but it's legal so all I can do is simply argue my opinion as you are doing. I can vote for public servants who agree with me and hope that one day the laws change.]

You appear more studied on this subject regarding biblical circumcision and current circumcision. Knowing today’s medical advances I would be surprised if circumcision methods hadn’t changed over time, but I am not an expert at all.

Obviously, God did not make a mistake. Biblical circumcision had nothing to do with health as far as I know…My last paragraph is based on faith (assuming you were questioning God’s Word and my belief in it). If anything…God declared that circumcision was okay. In various translations of the Bible, I cannot find a translation noting a “[nick] on the genitals”.
“Each male among you must be circumcised. You must cut off the flesh of your foreskin as a sign of the covenant between me and you. From generation to generation, every male child must be circumcised on the eighth day after his birth.” (in Gen 17)…That is the typical translation…

I appreciate your opinion, but we obviously completely disagree with one another and are dedicated to our stances.

Blessings!
Jeff

]]> Comment on Why wait till day 8 to Circumcise? by gregvalcourt http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/2008/07/01/why-wait-till-day-8-to-circumcise/#comment-1040 gregvalcourt Sat, 21 Nov 2009 05:56:17 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?p=228#comment-1040 Your choice to have your tonsils out was YOUR CHOICE. It could have been your parent's choice IF YOU WERE HAVING PROBLEMS at a young age. That would have been fair, given that your tonsils don't provide a useful function. Foreskin, on the other hand, doesn't cause most males any serious problems, and provides benefits during intercourse, making it more comfortable and pleasurable for both partners involved. If you had problems with ear infections, would you wish that your parents had cut off your ears? Circumcision is "no big deal" to you. Alright. Some people may feel cutting out tongues is no big deal. They would say "Cut'em out while children are young." Having no idea what you have "lost" is part of the problem. Nobody has the right to take something from you that was granted by nature. The cleaning argument is a load of Garbage. If someone can't clean themself properly in the shower, chances are they won't function very well in society. And what about males on other continents like Europe where genital cutting isn't so common? They don't seem to have hygienic problems. Personally, I would bear the burden of cleaning my body parts verses having them amputated. You can't compare forceful circumcision on infants to consensual ear piercings. You can't justify what our so called "civilized" culture does to males in relation to other cultures. The original circumcision described in the bible was just a nic on the genitals. Around comes the Victorian era and circumcision becomes a means to control sexuality. Circumcision has been promoted as a method to control masterbation by deadening a males genitals. There has never been a credible medical argument for circumcision. Some doctors have provided a service in direct contradiction with the hippocratic oath that they took. Some people would disagree that cutting off parts of a females genitals is mutilation. How far do you think that argument would go in our society? Doctors aren't usually prosecuted simply because this type of assault is tolerated in society, just the same way way that female circumcision was tolerated in some societies. However, there are some instances of doctors being successfully sued for performing this procedure (in the USA). There are some decisions that I think a parent can't make. Is it okay for a parent to cut off an arm? How about just a finger? Of course it's acceptable for me to disagree with opinions on circumcision. The real question is, is it okay for a parent or doctor to act on their opinion based on tradition instead of Science? I would like to note that in your last paragraph you are making an assertion without providing any reason or proof. I have a question for you: Why did God create males with highly sensitive foreskin that needs to be surgically removed? Did He make a mistake? Sincerely Yours, Greg Valcourt Your choice to have your tonsils out was YOUR CHOICE. It could have been your parent’s choice IF YOU WERE HAVING PROBLEMS at a young age. That would have been fair, given that your tonsils don’t provide a useful function. Foreskin, on the other hand, doesn’t cause most males any serious problems, and provides benefits during intercourse, making it more comfortable and pleasurable for both partners involved.

If you had problems with ear infections, would you wish that your parents had cut off your ears?

Circumcision is “no big deal” to you. Alright. Some people may feel cutting out tongues is no big deal. They would say “Cut’em out while children are young.”

Having no idea what you have “lost” is part of the problem. Nobody has the right to take something from you that was granted by nature.

The cleaning argument is a load of Garbage. If someone can’t clean themself properly in the shower, chances are they won’t function very well in society. And what about males on other continents like Europe where genital cutting isn’t so common? They don’t seem to have hygienic problems. Personally, I would bear the burden of cleaning my body parts verses having them amputated.

You can’t compare forceful circumcision on infants to consensual ear piercings. You can’t justify what our so called “civilized” culture does to males in relation to other cultures.

The original circumcision described in the bible was just a nic on the genitals. Around comes the Victorian era and circumcision becomes a means to control sexuality. Circumcision has been promoted as a method to control masterbation by deadening a males genitals. There has never been a credible medical argument for circumcision. Some doctors have provided a service in direct contradiction with the hippocratic oath that they took.

Some people would disagree that cutting off parts of a females genitals is mutilation. How far do you think that argument would go in our society?

Doctors aren’t usually prosecuted simply because this type of assault is tolerated in society, just the same way way that female circumcision was tolerated in some societies. However, there are some instances of doctors being successfully sued for performing this procedure (in the USA).

There are some decisions that I think a parent can’t make. Is it okay for a parent to cut off an arm? How about just a finger?

Of course it’s acceptable for me to disagree with opinions on circumcision. The real question is, is it okay for a parent or doctor to act on their opinion based on tradition instead of Science?

I would like to note that in your last paragraph you are making an assertion without providing any reason or proof.

I have a question for you: Why did God create males with highly sensitive foreskin that needs to be surgically removed? Did He make a mistake?

Sincerely Yours,
Greg Valcourt

]]> Comment on Why wait till day 8 to Circumcise? by tree63fan http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/2008/07/01/why-wait-till-day-8-to-circumcise/#comment-1039 tree63fan Sat, 21 Nov 2009 03:57:03 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?p=228#comment-1039 Thanks for continuing the discussion Greg.... I did not need to have my tonsils out. It was a choice for convenience since I dealt with tonsil stones. I would have much preferred to have just had them removed at a young age so I never had to deal with them slowly deteriorating in my throat...(FYI it was also my choice to have hernia surgery before it was truly even needed. I was told I was born with the inguinal hernia...boy that was a surgery that would have been nice to have just had done when I was a kid!) Maybe I'm being unfair not understanding where you are coming from and what your history is? In a nutshell what I'm saying is that circumcision to me is no big deal. I have no memory of it and I have no idea of what (if anything) I have "lost" with not having foreskin. All I do know is that it's very easy to keep myself clean. I do know that some males have a hard time keeping themselves clean especially at young ages and these males don't have foreskins to deal with. Either way, with or without a foreskin, a male CAN keep themselves reasonably clean, reasonable easily. I have no problem either way. To better compare the practice, think of ear piercing or any number of other "ritualistic" practices from around the world. I would never say that the stretching of a females neck over many years, nose piercings, branding, tattoos, or any number of "rights of passage" are 1) Mutilation or 2) Not a parents right. Most of these are cultural actions. I guess I would challenge you that if you think piercing a little girl's ear is okay and circumcision is not, then there is a problem with your logic. If you equally feel both are mutilation, then you are being consistent. Culturally, I understand that circumcision comes directly from the Biblical perspective of making the Israelites stand out and be different. This tradition was passed on and picked up by various people groups and we have what we have today. If you want to dive into medical "for and against" just let me know and I'll gladly research it. I just completely disagree that it's 1) Mutilation and 2) Not a parents right. It is NOT mutilation, because if it were doctors would be prosecuted for performing circumcision. And since, again, the law allows it, it IS most definitely a parents right. Also, I would have to argue against your last statement on amputation. If there was a decision to make for a child, then ultimately the parent is the one to make that decision. I realize you were implying "just chopping off a limb for no reason", but there IS a reason for circumcision. You just happen to disagree with it and that is completely acceptable and within your rights! Lastly, to tie this into my post. Please note that my post was all about showing one instance of many where God showed knowledge that we did not have available at the time (at least not easily). God knew the right timing to have the Israelites perform circumcisions and he told them. With respect, Jeff Thanks for continuing the discussion Greg….
I did not need to have my tonsils out. It was a choice for convenience since I dealt with tonsil stones. I would have much preferred to have just had them removed at a young age so I never had to deal with them slowly deteriorating in my throat…(FYI it was also my choice to have hernia surgery before it was truly even needed. I was told I was born with the inguinal hernia…boy that was a surgery that would have been nice to have just had done when I was a kid!)
Maybe I’m being unfair not understanding where you are coming from and what your history is?
In a nutshell what I’m saying is that circumcision to me is no big deal. I have no memory of it and I have no idea of what (if anything) I have “lost” with not having foreskin. All I do know is that it’s very easy to keep myself clean. I do know that some males have a hard time keeping themselves clean especially at young ages and these males don’t have foreskins to deal with. Either way, with or without a foreskin, a male CAN keep themselves reasonably clean, reasonable easily. I have no problem either way.
To better compare the practice, think of ear piercing or any number of other “ritualistic” practices from around the world. I would never say that the stretching of a females neck over many years, nose piercings, branding, tattoos, or any number of “rights of passage” are 1) Mutilation or 2) Not a parents right. Most of these are cultural actions. I guess I would challenge you that if you think piercing a little girl’s ear is okay and circumcision is not, then there is a problem with your logic. If you equally feel both are mutilation, then you are being consistent.
Culturally, I understand that circumcision comes directly from the Biblical perspective of making the Israelites stand out and be different. This tradition was passed on and picked up by various people groups and we have what we have today. If you want to dive into medical “for and against” just let me know and I’ll gladly research it.
I just completely disagree that it’s 1) Mutilation and 2) Not a parents right. It is NOT mutilation, because if it were doctors would be prosecuted for performing circumcision. And since, again, the law allows it, it IS most definitely a parents right.
Also, I would have to argue against your last statement on amputation. If there was a decision to make for a child, then ultimately the parent is the one to make that decision. I realize you were implying “just chopping off a limb for no reason”, but there IS a reason for circumcision. You just happen to disagree with it and that is completely acceptable and within your rights!
Lastly, to tie this into my post. Please note that my post was all about showing one instance of many where God showed knowledge that we did not have available at the time (at least not easily). God knew the right timing to have the Israelites perform circumcisions and he told them.
With respect,
Jeff

]]> Comment on Why wait till day 8 to Circumcise? by gregvalcourt http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/2008/07/01/why-wait-till-day-8-to-circumcise/#comment-1038 gregvalcourt Sat, 21 Nov 2009 00:25:34 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?p=228#comment-1038 What are you saying tree63fan? That it might one day, in rare circumstances, be medically necessary to get circumcised, therefore it's beneficial to mutilate a male? Sorry about your tonsils, but no one really misses their tonsils once they're gone. It's not an apt comparison. It's not a parents decision to circumcise anymore than it's a parents decision to amputate a babies limbs. What are you saying tree63fan? That it might one day, in rare circumstances, be medically necessary to get circumcised, therefore it’s beneficial to mutilate a male? Sorry about your tonsils, but no one really misses their tonsils once they’re gone. It’s not an apt comparison.

It’s not a parents decision to circumcise anymore than it’s a parents decision to amputate a babies limbs.

]]> Comment on My Journal by tree63fan http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/my-journal/#comment-1036 tree63fan Tue, 17 Nov 2009 13:08:15 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?page_id=810#comment-1036 I've had a pretty good week. Our small group is meeting again and this Christian interaction will only benefit the whole family as well as the others in the group. I'm wrapping up a couple of task this week. The class I was teaching on Sunday's is over and the Mens group on Thursdays wraps up this week. Both have been a blessing. A good friend lost one of their twins due to premature labor. My heart is saddened for the grief they must deal with but is glad in knowing this little one, Matthew, is with the Lord. I’ve had a pretty good week. Our small group is meeting again and this Christian interaction will only benefit the whole family as well as the others in the group. I’m wrapping up a couple of task this week. The class I was teaching on Sunday’s is over and the Mens group on Thursdays wraps up this week. Both have been a blessing. A good friend lost one of their twins due to premature labor. My heart is saddened for the grief they must deal with but is glad in knowing this little one, Matthew, is with the Lord.

]]> Comment on What’s in a Commandment? #10 by tree63fan http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/whats-in-a-commandment-10/#comment-1035 tree63fan Thu, 12 Nov 2009 23:21:46 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?p=1847#comment-1035 This explanation makes a whole lot more sense to me. One because I love God's sense of humor, and two because out of the two topics 'levels of hell' and 'levels of heaven' I believe there is much more evidence in the Bible regarding levels in heaven (hence some Saints are better than others in a sense). When I say Saint, of course, I'm talking about any Believer. Now saying that, we could get into a whole 'nother discussion about the parable of the wages where a man who works a full day gets the same reward as the man who comes in at the last minute and works a few minutes.... I will humbly apologize for taking your comments a bit more seriously than I think you intended them to be! Thanks for the discussion and see at Moresec0de's blog I'm sure. This explanation makes a whole lot more sense to me. One because I love God’s sense of humor, and two because out of the two topics ‘levels of hell’ and ‘levels of heaven’ I believe there is much more evidence in the Bible regarding levels in heaven (hence some Saints are better than others in a sense). When I say Saint, of course, I’m talking about any Believer.
Now saying that, we could get into a whole ‘nother discussion about the parable of the wages where a man who works a full day gets the same reward as the man who comes in at the last minute and works a few minutes….
I will humbly apologize for taking your comments a bit more seriously than I think you intended them to be!
Thanks for the discussion and see at Moresec0de’s blog I’m sure.

]]> Comment on What’s in a Commandment? #10 by MacGregor http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/whats-in-a-commandment-10/#comment-1034 MacGregor Thu, 12 Nov 2009 12:54:35 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?p=1847#comment-1034 Here's the deal, i agree with everyone you said, and that we have all sinned and come short of the glory of God is the final answer. But given the fact that we are ALL sinners, my support is simply common sense. As its inevitable that we live a lifetime of sin, it would impossible to draw distinctions between sins, but my common sense tells me that God has a sense of humor, and a man who lives his life for God, coming short often, repenting and believing, is looked at al ittle differently than the sadistic murderer who's lived a life of knowing sin only to repent at the last minute. If we assume God has no common sense we're all dooomed. Here’s the deal, i agree with everyone you said, and that we have all sinned and come short of the glory of God is the final answer.
But given the fact that we are ALL sinners, my support is simply common sense. As its inevitable that we live a lifetime of sin, it would impossible to draw distinctions between sins, but my common sense tells me that God has a sense of humor, and a man who lives his life for God, coming short often, repenting and believing, is looked at al ittle differently than the sadistic murderer who’s lived a life of knowing sin only to repent at the last minute. If we assume God has no common sense we’re all dooomed.

]]> Comment on What’s in a Commandment? #10 by tree63fan http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/whats-in-a-commandment-10/#comment-1033 tree63fan Thu, 12 Nov 2009 02:04:13 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?p=1847#comment-1033 MacGregor, Thanks for commenting back. It can be argued that the Bible describes levels of hell and levels of heaven. Unfortunately, in my brief studies it's not crystal clear. I mention that as it's one of the few examples of a gray area regarding sin and its consequences. To us humans there are definitely gradations of sin! If there weren't our thought life would be infinitely more prosecutable. <strong>But</strong>, alas, God knows our thought life and Jesus equates hatred to murder and lust of the mind to adultery. The Bible clearly teaches that one sin damns you to hell. The truth is that all humans sin many, many, many times and are never judged for these spiritual transgressions. We may be judged on some in this world now, but we have not been judged by God. Hence, our need for Jesus. In a nutshell, Jesus paid the fine for the laws we broke. Without accepting this payment, we are destined for the verdict we deserve. To God, sin is sin. There are truly no exceptions for there is no man who has only sinned once. (i.e. One who lusted versus one who murdered). A good analogy to consider: God is holy, holy, holy (the original language uses this triple repetition due to the magnified reality). A little sin in the presence of holy, holy, holy is like just a little water thrown on hot oil. BOTH produce an explosion. If you still think God views all sins on some scale of bad versus worse please provide some Biblical support. Off hand I can think of blaspheming the Holy Spirit, and also a mention of "deadly sins" in Proverbs 6. But as I said, all sin is deadly. <strong>So, again, I guess the short question in this long post would have been, what biblical support do you use to support your position of belief in "gradations of sin"?</strong> MacGregor,
Thanks for commenting back. It can be argued that the Bible describes levels of hell and levels of heaven. Unfortunately, in my brief studies it’s not crystal clear. I mention that as it’s one of the few examples of a gray area regarding sin and its consequences.
To us humans there are definitely gradations of sin! If there weren’t our thought life would be infinitely more prosecutable. But, alas, God knows our thought life and Jesus equates hatred to murder and lust of the mind to adultery.
The Bible clearly teaches that one sin damns you to hell. The truth is that all humans sin many, many, many times and are never judged for these spiritual transgressions. We may be judged on some in this world now, but we have not been judged by God. Hence, our need for Jesus. In a nutshell, Jesus paid the fine for the laws we broke. Without accepting this payment, we are destined for the verdict we deserve.
To God, sin is sin. There are truly no exceptions for there is no man who has only sinned once. (i.e. One who lusted versus one who murdered).
A good analogy to consider:
God is holy, holy, holy (the original language uses this triple repetition due to the magnified reality). A little sin in the presence of holy, holy, holy is like just a little water thrown on hot oil. BOTH produce an explosion.
If you still think God views all sins on some scale of bad versus worse please provide some Biblical support. Off hand I can think of blaspheming the Holy Spirit, and also a mention of “deadly sins” in Proverbs 6. But as I said, all sin is deadly.
So, again, I guess the short question in this long post would have been, what biblical support do you use to support your position of belief in “gradations of sin”?

]]> Comment on What’s in a Commandment? #10 by MacGregor http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/whats-in-a-commandment-10/#comment-1032 MacGregor Thu, 12 Nov 2009 01:24:57 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?p=1847#comment-1032 Right, but are you saying you dont believe in gradations of sin? Or do you equate an oft thought of a hot woman to murder? I absolutely do not, thats why i made my comment as to extensive or excessive drunkeness thats all. Right, but are you saying you dont believe in gradations of sin? Or do you equate an oft thought of a hot woman to murder?
I absolutely do not, thats why i made my comment as to extensive or excessive drunkeness thats all.

]]> Comment on What’s in a Commandment? #10 by tree63fan http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/whats-in-a-commandment-10/#comment-1031 tree63fan Tue, 10 Nov 2009 02:11:42 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?p=1847#comment-1031 Would that mean that keeping the Sabbath Holy would only mean, "mostly" Holy? Or, murder is okay as long as it's not excessive? Jesus, himself noted that lusting after someone in your mind equated to adultery. I don't think your observation is supported by the Bible. Keep in mind that debauchery (drunkenness or meaning "out of ones mind due to some outside influence") is not one of the Ten Commandments.....yet it is important. Debauchery is being drunk, high on drugs or in a state where you are not thinking straight enough to do what you would do if you were sober. The Bible doesn't speak about being under the influence of 1 or 2 beers. The Bible is full of wine being drunk at meals and only condemning drunkenness. The Bible is NOT full of minor coveting and dismissing this coveting. So in a sense you haven't compared apples to apples. That's my take, thank you for sharing your thoughts! Would that mean that keeping the Sabbath Holy would only mean, “mostly” Holy? Or, murder is okay as long as it’s not excessive? Jesus, himself noted that lusting after someone in your mind equated to adultery. I don’t think your observation is supported by the Bible.

Keep in mind that debauchery (drunkenness or meaning “out of ones mind due to some outside influence”) is not one of the Ten Commandments…..yet it is important. Debauchery is being drunk, high on drugs or in a state where you are not thinking straight enough to do what you would do if you were sober. The Bible doesn’t speak about being under the influence of 1 or 2 beers. The Bible is full of wine being drunk at meals and only condemning drunkenness. The Bible is NOT full of minor coveting and dismissing this coveting. So in a sense you haven’t compared apples to apples.

That’s my take, thank you for sharing your thoughts!

]]> Comment on What’s in a Commandment? #10 by MacGregor http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/2009/10/31/whats-in-a-commandment-10/#comment-1030 MacGregor Mon, 09 Nov 2009 17:45:28 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?p=1847#comment-1030 i think this speaks for to extensive "coveting" such as drunkenness doesnt speak to a couple beers on a saturday night.. i think this speaks for to extensive “coveting” such as drunkenness doesnt speak to a couple beers on a saturday night..

]]> Comment on My Journal by tree63fan http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/my-journal/#comment-1029 tree63fan Sun, 08 Nov 2009 21:42:47 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?page_id=810#comment-1029 I feel good. I'm not perfect but I feel good. This week has had it's ups and downs, but one positive I thank God for is my desire and tenacity toward losing weight. I've lost over 7 lbs the last 18 days! On my mind is my wife and her dealing with work stress. I'm not sure what more I can do to help be supportive. When I've spent time in the Bible its been deep and meaningful. Prayer has been short and less meaningful. Time with Camden has been a blessing. I made some conscience decisions this past week or so that were much better ways of handling recurring life with a 6 year old. :) I feel good. I’m not perfect but I feel good. This week has had it’s ups and downs, but one positive I thank God for is my desire and tenacity toward losing weight. I’ve lost over 7 lbs the last 18 days! On my mind is my wife and her dealing with work stress. I’m not sure what more I can do to help be supportive. When I’ve spent time in the Bible its been deep and meaningful. Prayer has been short and less meaningful. Time with Camden has been a blessing. I made some conscience decisions this past week or so that were much better ways of handling recurring life with a 6 year old. :)

]]> Comment on My Journal by tree63fan http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/my-journal/#comment-1025 tree63fan Sun, 01 Nov 2009 01:07:06 +0000 http://tree63fan.wordpress.com/?page_id=810#comment-1025 Well, I've been challenged in several ways recently. Whether it's 3 or more things going wrong all at the same time, or not handling my son pushing my buttons at times, I've been able to see how I SHOULD have responded in the end. I been able to talk to my son and explain how I was wrong and what I should have done. In the end, blessed be the name of the Lord in GOOD times and in BAD. On another note...we will always have the poor, at what level does God expect me to help? I could spend all I have, or feed someone a meal, what would you have me do Lord? Well, I’ve been challenged in several ways recently. Whether it’s 3 or more things going wrong all at the same time, or not handling my son pushing my buttons at times, I’ve been able to see how I SHOULD have responded in the end. I been able to talk to my son and explain how I was wrong and what I should have done.
In the end, blessed be the name of the Lord in GOOD times and in BAD.
On another note…we will always have the poor, at what level does God expect me to help? I could spend all I have, or feed someone a meal, what would you have me do Lord?

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